[Heb-NACO] Admor Shelita

Wed Oct 7 15:52:56 EDT 2015

Admor functions as a title (i.e. Rabbi, Haham, Av bet din (a.bd.) If used
without qualifiers it would be like using Bishop, Cardinal, Patriarch
without specifying diocese or sect, or active years, and is more
appropriate to the MARC 374.   Admor mi-(name of Kehilah/place) is more
appropriate as the cross reference even if it is not a direct phrase
(Example  heading Rymanower, Ẓevi Hirsh,|d1778-1847
 have the cross reference Admor, mi-Rimanov,|d1778-1747
 Sefer Beʼerot ha-mayim ha-shalem :|bosef maʼamarim ʻal ha-Torah u-moʻadim
liḳuṭim yeḳarim, śiḥot ḳodesh, minhagim, ṿe-igrot ḳodesh /|c...
Tsevi ha-kohen ... me-Rimanov.

https://books.google.com/books?id=NKDXAAAAMAAJ&dq=%D7%90%D7%93%D7%9E%D7%95%D7%A8&pg=PA3#v=onepage&q&f=false
)

or
example ARN 2703933  Daṿid Yitsḥaḳ Ayziḳ, ǂc mi-Sḳolye
to have the cross reference
4000  Admor mi-Sḳolye,
but not the cross reference
4000  Admor ha-G. ha-Ḳ. (Admor ha-gaon ha-kadosh)
the later is not useful or relevant.

Example ARN 2859042
1001 Ḳahn, Avraham Yitsḥaḳ
the 4xx Admor Shelita  adds nothing.
the supporting 670 has a qualifying Kehilah so that an unqualified Admor
should not be a cross reference
670  His Sefer Divre emunah, 1989 or 1990: ǂb pref. (Avraham Yitsḥaḳ
Ḳahn; Admor Sheliṭa) v. 2, t.p. (Rabi Avraham Yitsḥaḳ, z. ts.
ṿe-ḳ.l.l.h.h.; asher or ḳedushato zaraḥ be-ʻi. ha-ḳ. Yerushala[y]im
... ḳehila ḳadisha Toldot Aharon)

the phrase Shelita or Zatsal,  should not be part of the name heading, (as
with other generic descriptors (ha-kadosh, ha-gaon, ha- harif etc.) and
should be omitted/skipped and removed from records when being worked on

On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 2:02 PM, <heb-naco-request at lists.osu.edu> wrote:

> Send Heb-naco mailing list submissions to
>         heb-naco at lists.osu.edu
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         https://lists.osu.edu/mailman/listinfo/heb-naco
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>         heb-naco-request at lists.osu.edu
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>         heb-naco-owner at lists.osu.edu
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Heb-naco digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Haggadah for Jewish Christians (Taub, Aaron)
>    2. Re: Admor Shelita as a cross reference for Hassidic Rebbes
>       (Kuperman, Aaron)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2015 13:23:10 -0400
> From: "Taub, Aaron" <atau at loc.gov>
> To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel <heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>
> Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Haggadah for Jewish Christians
> Message-ID:
>         <0F69EAE9F3A5114F8C1A62EE3B6FB41F78ACCA4BCF at LCXCLMB03.LCDS.LOC.GOV
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Dear Barry, Heidi, and Group,
>
> Judaica catalogers at LC have not always handled materials generated by
> Messianic Jews/Jews for Jesus/Jewish Christians.  However, there are
> numerous Passover materials from this constituency in the LC database.
> They are typically classed in BV199.P25 [Passover services (Christian
> observance) with the subject heading Passover $x Christian observance.  If
> the actual Haggadah text (excluding the rubrics) is the standard Haggadah
> text, you can add Seder $x Liturgy $v Texts.  I recommend following that
> model.
>
> I hope this helps.
>
> Best wishes,
> Aaron T.
>
>
> From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+atau=loc.gov at lists.osu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Barry Walfish
> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2015 4:41 PM
> To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
> Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Haggadah for Jewish Christians
>
> Thanks, Heidi,
>
> I'll follow your suggestions for now.
>
> Shanah tovah to you and yours,
> All the best,
>
> Barry
>
> Barry Dov Walfish, Ph.D.
> Judaica Specialist
> University of Toronto Libraries
> Toronto, ON M5S 1A5
> Canada
> ________________________________
> From: Heb-naco [heb-naco-bounces at lists.osu.edu] on behalf of Heidi G
> Lerner [lerner at stanford.edu]
> Sent: Friday, September 11, 2015 11:15 AM
> To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel (heb-naco at lists.osu.edu<mailto:
> heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>)
> Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Haggadah for Jewish Christians
>
> Hi Barry,
>
>
>
> I will look forward to LC's response on this issue. I looked for related
> resources in the bibliographic file and found an LC record for a 1988 book
> entitled: Siddur for messianic Jews. It appears that LC did not consider
> this prayer-book a true siddur.  The cataloger did not provide a uniform
> title for this work and entered it under the title proper with a subject
> heading "Jewish Christianns--Prayerbooks and devotions.
>
>
>
> If were to follow this model I would think that entering it under the
> title proper would be appropriate and using perhaps the following subject
> headings:
>
>
>
> Haggadah--Adaptations
>
> Jewish Christians--Prayers and devotions.
>
>
>
> I really don't know if creating a preferred title "Haggadah (Jewish
> Christians)" is correct or not. This gets into a discussion that I don't
> feel qualified to enter into.
>
>
>
> Best, Heidi
>
>
>
> Heidi G. Lerner
>
> Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica
>
> Metadata Dept.
>
> Stanford University Libraries
>
> Stanford, CA 94305-6004
>
> ph: 650-725-9953
>
> fax: 650-725-1120
>
> e-mail: lerner at stanford.edu<mailto:lerner at stanford.edu>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Heb-naco <heb-naco-bounces+lerner=stanford.edu at lists.osu.edu<mailto:
> heb-naco-bounces+lerner=stanford.edu at lists.osu.edu>> on behalf of Barry
> Walfish <barry.walfish at utoronto.ca<mailto:barry.walfish at utoronto.ca>>
> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 2:36 PM
> To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel (heb-naco at lists.osu.edu<mailto:
> heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>)
> Subject: [Heb-NACO] Haggadah for Jewish Christians
>
>
> Dear Safranim,
>
>
>
> I recently catalogued a messianic Haggadah and was surprised that I could
> not find a proper title for such a work. It was listed under Haggadah in
> OCLC.
>
> Unless I missed it, I'd like to propose that there be added to the
> authority file a heading for Haggadah (Jewish-Christian) or something along
> those lines.
>
>
>
> Any thoughts?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> Barry
>
>
>
>
>
> Barry Dov Walfish, Ph.D.
>
> Judaica and Theology Specialist
>
> Collection Development Department and
>
> Thomas Fisher Rare Book Library
>
> University of Toronto Library
>
> 130 St. George St.
>
> Toronto, ON
>
> Canada M5S 1A5
>
> phone: 416-946-3176 or 416-978-4319
>
> fax: 416-978-1667 or 416-946-0635
>
> e-mail: barry.walfish at utoronto.ca<mailto:barry.walfish at utoronto.ca>
>
>
>
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://lists.osu.edu/pipermail/heb-naco/attachments/20151007/25a132c8/attachment.html
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2015 13:57:51 -0400
> From: "Kuperman, Aaron" <akup at loc.gov>
> To: "heb-naco at lists.osu.edu" <heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>
> Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Admor Shelita as a cross reference for
>         Hassidic Rebbes
> Message-ID:
>         <6D7F242BB22CA74191053C7DEC1E88D78430734048 at LCXCLMB02.LCDS.LOC.GOV
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> They are honorifics, similar to ?Mr.? or ?The honorable?  or  ?H.R.H.? or
> ?Ph.D.? or ?Esq.?
>
> Do we normally include honorifics in name authorities?
>
> Exception, if someone is known as the ?Admor mi-??????, so wouldn?t we
> treat it the way we treat any other name.
>
> Whomever but ?Admor shelitah? in a 400 doesn?t understand.
>
> From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+akup=loc.gov at lists.osu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Miriam Gloger
> Sent: Friday, September 25, 2015 2:35 PM
> To: heb-naco at lists.osu.edu
> Subject: [Heb-NACO] Admor Shelita as a cross reference for Hassidic Rebbes
>
> The term Admor Shelita ????"? ????"? (Adoni, mori v.e-rabi she-yih.yeh
> le-orekh yamim t.ovim amen --
> my master, teacher, and Rabbi, he should live to the length of good days
> amen)
> is kind of like saying his excellency, or his holiness -- it is an
> honorific typically used for Hassidic Rebbes.  In some cases it is used
> somewhat correctly as Admor of a place/Congregation
> but even in those cases, it probably should have dates because Hassidic
> groups/communities are dynastic so that there are 1) often several
> generations of Admor mi-(name the city) 2) in some cases like Satmar,
> Bobov, Vizhnitz, there are splits, -- so that there are 2 Admor mi-(name
> the group) at a time writing about the same subject!
>
>
>
> Below are a few examples of usage with and without a date.  In the second
> record Shelita $c Admor makes absolutely no sense.
>
> ARN 6015791
> 010  nr2003011259
> 040  DLC-R ?b eng ?c DLC-R ?d OCoLC
> 1001 Horov?its, Shemu?el Tsevi
> 4000 Admor Shelit?a
> 4001 ?????? ?????
> 4001 ???????, ????? ???
> 667  Machine-derived non-Latin script reference project.
> 667  Non-Latin script references not evaluated.
> 670  Sefer Shivh?e Tehilim, 2000: ?b t.p. (Maran Admor, shelit?a) p. 32
> (author of T?ava di-Shemu?el)
> 670  RLIN, 31 Mar. 2003 ?b (hdg.: Horov?its, Shemu?el Tsevi; author of
> T?ava di-Shemu?el)
>
> ARN 9989794
> 010  no2014136816
> 040  CSt-HC ?b eng ?e rda ?c CSt-HC ?d DLC
> 1001 Wassertheil, Chaim Elazar
> 4000 Admor Shelit?a, ?d active 2014
> 4001 ?????? ??????
> 4001 Shelit?a, ?c Admor, ?d active 2014
> 4001 ??????, ??????
> 4001 V?assert?hail, H?ayim El?azar
> 4001 ????????????, ???? ?????
> 4000 Admor, ?c mi-Rimanov
> 667  Non-Latin script reference not evaluated.
> 670  Sefer K?edushat Shabat: ?b title page (Admor Shelit?a)
> 670  Wikipedia, viewed Oct. 9, 2014 ?b (Rimenov (Hasidic dynatsty; Rabbi
> Chaim Elazar Wassertheil, rabbi of "Beeras Hamayim" in Borough Bark,
> Brookyn)
> 670  National Library of Israel authority file, viewed online Oct. 9, 2014
> ?b (hdg.:???????????, ???? ????? =  V?assert?hail, H?ayim ?El?azar; xref:
> ?????? ??????? (???? ???? = Admor mi-Rimanov (Boro Park?))
>
> --
> Miriam Gloger
> Librarian II  Database Management Team (CMA)
>
> (917) 229-9575
> The New York Public Library - BookOps
>
> Library Services Center
> 31-11 Thomson Ave
> Long Island City, NY 11101-3006
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://lists.osu.edu/pipermail/heb-naco/attachments/20151007/c3ec127a/attachment.html
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> Heb-naco mailing list
> Heb-naco at lists.osu.edu
> https://lists.osu.edu/mailman/listinfo/heb-naco
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of Heb-naco Digest, Vol 56, Issue 1
> ***************************************
>

-- 
*Miriam Gloger*
Librarian II  Database Management Team (CMA)

(917) 229-9575
The New York Public Library - BookOps

Library Services Center
31-11 Thomson Ave
Long Island City, NY 11101-3006
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.osu.edu/pipermail/heb-naco/attachments/20151007/a97416d3/attachment-0001.html>