[Heb-NACO] Psalms 45, 9: Mini simhukha

[Dickel, Geraldine]

BDB (Brown, Driver, Briggs) Biblical Hebrew lexicon lists מני under the preposition מן and says that it is a poetic form of the preposition with the old י of the genitive.

Jerry Anne

From: heb-naco-bounces at lists.service.ohio-state.edu [mailto:heb-naco-bounces at lists.service.ohio-state.edu] On Behalf Of Jasmin Nof
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 12:16 PM
To: heb-naco at lists.service.ohio-state.edu
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Psalms 45, 9: Mini simhukha

oops, that was meant to be "prEposition".  i'm not in favor of proposing based on propositions... ;-)

happy friday!


On 5/3/2013 12:14 PM, Jasmin Nof wrote:
just to strengthen the proposition proposal, a few more verses with מני from תהילים, none of which make mention of an instrument:

יט:כג  כִּי כָל-מִשְׁפָּטָיו לְנֶגְדִּי;    וְחֻקֹּתָיו, לֹא-אָסִיר מֶנִּי. =
23 For all His ordinances were before me, and I put not away His statutes from me.

מד:יא: תְּשִׁיבֵנוּ אָחוֹר, מִנִּי-צָר;    וּמְשַׂנְאֵינוּ, שָׁסוּ לָמוֹ =
11 Thou makest us to turn back from the adversary; and they that hate us spoil at their will.

מד:יא: לֹא-נָסוֹג אָחוֹר לִבֵּנוּ;    וַתֵּט אֲשֻׁרֵינוּ, מִנִּי אָרְחֶךָ. =
19 Our heart is not turned back, neither have our steps declined from Thy path;

(and 7 others...) jasmin

On 5/3/2013 11:59 AM, Jasmin Nof wrote:
i'm not so sure, heidi.  looking at other places in appears in tanakh (searching the word מני in מאגר ספרות הקודש, http://kodesh.snunit.k12.il/cgi-bin/kodesh/search_adv.pl?search=%D7%9E%D7%A0%D7%99) and looking at the translations of the found verses at מכון ממרא, it appears to be a preposition.   e.g.

1. שופטים פרק ה: פסוק י"ד<http://kodesh.snunit.k12.il/i/t/t0705.htm#14>: מִנִּי אֶפְרַיִם, שָׁרְשָׁם  {ר} בַּעֲמָלֵק,  {ס}  אַחֲרֶיךָ בִנְיָמִין, בַּעֲמָמֶיךָ;  {ס}  מִנִּי  {ר} מָכִיר, יָרְדוּ מְחֹקְקִים,  {ס}  וּמִזְּבוּלֻן, מֹשְׁכִים בְּשֵׁבֶט  {ר} סֹפֵר.  {ס} =
14 Out of Ephraim came they whose root is in Amalek; after thee, Benjamin, among thy peoples; out of Machir came down governors, and out of Zebulun they that handle the marshal's staff.


2. ישעיה פרק כב: פסוק ד<http://kodesh.snunit.k12.il/i/t/t1022.htm#4>: עַל-כֵּן אָמַרְתִּי שְׁעוּ מִנִּי, אֲמָרֵר בַּבֶּכִי; אַל-תָּאִיצוּ לְנַחֲמֵנִי, עַל-שֹׁד בַּת-עַמִּי =
 4 Therefore said I: 'Look away from me, I will weep bitterly; strain not to comfort me, for the destruction of the daughter of my people.'



3. ישעיהו פרק ל: פסוק א<http://kodesh.snunit.k12.il/i/t/t1030.htm#1>: הוֹי בָּנִים סוֹרְרִים, נְאֻם-יְהוָה, לַעֲשׂוֹת עֵצָה וְלֹא מִנִּי, וְלִנְסֹךְ מַסֵּכָה וְלֹא רוּחִי--לְמַעַן סְפוֹת חַטָּאת, עַל-חַטָּאת. =

1 Woe to the rebellious children, saith the LORD, that take counsel, but not of Me; and that form projects, but not of My spirit, that they may add sin to sin;



hence, i'd go with mi-ni, as in, "from Me are you made glad".  this doesn't match the translation of מכון ממרא for

תהלים מד:9: מֹר-וַאֲהָלוֹת קְצִיעוֹת, כָּל-בִּגְדֹתֶיךָ; מִן-הֵיכְלֵי שֵׁן, מִנִּי שִׂמְּחוּךָ,=

9 Myrrh, and aloes, and cassia are all thy garments; out of ivory palaces stringed instruments have made thee glad,

but it does match this translation:

"Myrrh and aloes, and cassia, are all your garments, [more splendid] than ivory palaces are Mine that will make you rejoice."  (sorry, can't find the source of the translation.  it's at http://www.dailytehillim.com/Default.aspx?Perek=45)



שבת שלום, jasmin



On 5/3/2013 11:15 AM, Heidi G Lerner wrote:
My thought is that it is "mini" [since?] and not  "mi-ni". Even-Shoshan says that it is a poetical form often used in Tanakh.
Heidi
________________________________
From: "Yossi Galron" <jgalron at gmail.com><mailto:jgalron at gmail.com>
To: "heb-naco" <heb-naco at lists.service.ohio-state.edu><mailto:heb-naco at lists.service.ohio-state.edu>
Sent: Friday, May 3, 2013 7:57:12 AM
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Psalms 45, 9: Mini simhukha
Colleagues
I have a commentary on some Masekhtot. The title is ספר מני שמחוך and the source of the title is from Tehilim, 45:9
My question is about the first word: is it Mini or Mi-ni (in other words: is the Mem an article?)

Thanks for your insights

Yossi


Joseph (Yossi) Galron-Goldschlaeger
E-Mail: galron.1 at osu.edu<mailto:galron.1 at osu.edu>  or jgalron at gmail.com<mailto:jgalron at gmail.com>
Tel.: (614) 292-3362,  Fax: (614)292-1918
Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature: http://hebrewlit.notlong.com

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