[Heb-NACO] Fwd: Arab name

Thu Jul 28 07:48:00 EDT 2022

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From: Galron, Joseph
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 12:13:04 AM
To: Rachel Simon <rsimon at princeton.edu>
Subject: RE: Arab name

רחל

אני הייתי הולך בעקבות הספרייה הלאומית בירושלים

ראי בקישורית הבאה

http://uli.nli.org.il/F/Y6H37US26696JGUARY9TT4767DTBAA7FBNCQ3M216RBVRY3378-08241?func=full-set-set&set_number=000355&set_entry=000001&format=001

הצורה הלטינית שבחרו   Khalefa, Ali  וזאת על סמך:

 On verso of title page: Kheffiyeh among yarmulkes / Ali Khalefa

עם רמיזות מ:

Khalefa, Ali Saleh

Khalifah, 'Ali Salih

והייתי מוסיף על כך גם:

Halifah, Ali (עם כל הנקודות הדרושות)

ראי גם:  https://viaf.org/viaf/3161693955115932328

From: Rachel Simon
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 3:46 PM
To: Galron, Joseph <galron.1 at osu.edu>
Subject: RE: Arab name

Drive safely! Rachel From: Galron, Joseph <galron.1 at osu.edu<mailto:galron.1 at osu.edu>> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 2:40 PM To: Rachel Simon <rsimon at princeton.edu<mailto:rsimon at princeton.edu>> Subject: Re: Arab name ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍

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Drive safely!

Rachel

From: Galron, Joseph <galron.1 at osu.edu<mailto:galron.1 at osu.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 2:40 PM
To: Rachel Simon <rsimon at princeton.edu<mailto:rsimon at princeton.edu>>
Subject: Re: Arab name

אכתוב לך כשאגיע הביתה.

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________________________________

From: Rachel Simon <rsimon at princeton.edu<mailto:rsimon at princeton.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 1:55:39 PM
To: Galron, Joseph <galron.1 at osu.edu<mailto:galron.1 at osu.edu>>
Subject: FW: Arab name

יוסי מה הוא אומר??? אין לי כתובת של המחבר. לעשות לפי כללי העברית? בדקתי איך מעשה לאנטטון שמאס וסייד קשוע: לפי העברית (ובפרסומיהם הראשונים אין ערבית). כעת פחות חם!!! רחל From: Shinohara, Jasmin <jshino at pobox.upenn.edu<mailto:jshino at pobox.upenn.edu>> ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍

יוסי מה הוא אומר???

אין לי כתובת של המחבר. לעשות לפי כללי העברית? בדקתי איך מעשה לאנטטון שמאס וסייד קשוע: לפי העברית (ובפרסומיהם הראשונים אין ערבית).

כעת פחות חם!!!

רחל

From: Shinohara, Jasmin <jshino at pobox.upenn.edu<mailto:jshino at pobox.upenn.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 1:37 PM
To: Rachel Simon <rsimon at princeton.edu<mailto:rsimon at princeton.edu>>; Miller, Caroline <crmiller at library.ucla.edu<mailto:crmiller at library.ucla.edu>>; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel <heb-naco at lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>>; lerner at stanford.edu<mailto:lerner at stanford.edu>
Subject: RE: Arab name

In a case like this, I’d be tempted to reach out to the author to ask his preferred form. That would trump all other considerations.

From: Rachel Simon <rsimon at princeton.edu<mailto:rsimon at princeton.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 1:27 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin <jshino at pobox.upenn.edu<mailto:jshino at pobox.upenn.edu>>; Miller, Caroline <crmiller at library.ucla.edu<mailto:crmiller at library.ucla.edu>>; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel <heb-naco at lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>>; lerner at stanford.edu<mailto:lerner at stanford.edu>
Subject: RE: Arab name

He wrote the book in Hebrew, and it is his first publication. So, which rules should apply?

Rachel

From: Shinohara, Jasmin <jshino at pobox.upenn.edu<mailto:jshino at pobox.upenn.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 1:06 PM
To: Miller, Caroline <crmiller at library.ucla.edu<mailto:crmiller at library.ucla.edu>>; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel <heb-naco at lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>>; Rachel Simon <rsimon at princeton.edu<mailto:rsimon at princeton.edu>>; lerner at stanford.edu<mailto:lerner at stanford.edu>
Subject: RE: Arab name

Hi, all!

Caroline, that is a good supposition, and I used to think the same, until Heidi informed me that Arabic names play by their own rules, not our Hebraica name rules.

Rachel, I’m afraid I don’t have a specific citation for you, but I’d refer you to the Arabic NACO Manual, https://library.princeton.edu/departments/tsd/katmandu/cp20/aranatoc.html<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2F*2Fnam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com*2F*3Furl*3Dhttps*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2Flibrary.princeton.edu*2Fdepartments*2Ftsd*2Fkatmandu*2Fcp20*2Faranatoc.html__*3B!!IBzWLUs!Tx8j3jSN-f3ZJrEILIaGxegz0KTft38_gqDGTrMH5zEdeeNrrQe5kfSXtdGI5l6ldEjsLVYdrl4yrTolBUPDbG4l*24*26data*3D05*7C01*7Crsimon*40princeton.edu*7Cf2d10ac138f24a6589ac08da6ff69c0c*7C2ff601167431425db5af077d7791bda4*7C0*7C0*7C637945402224990892*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C3000*7C*7C*7C*26sdata*3D0zyJUFVcHU4ZeU1wzo473eEP2A78Ij9um6mDSxpRt00*3D*26reserved*3D0__*3BJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUl!!KGKeukY!zVBxA1o_F15Rzje5gr381XawS_rYQ7nojrhu1KB8HD2B8GVvomcUsl2QKX6XNKDl5mFHfy-U9D0RLfPbU7A*24&data=05*7C01*7Crsimon*40princeton.edu*7Cb78e2a0e7252485ef30408da6fff606f*7C2ff601167431425db5af077d7791bda4*7C0*7C0*7C637945439884458683*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C3000*7C*7C*7C&sdata=dY58v690NzOXSRN7Hng4gRh6osCXLvhSRVUwf2C1IAA*3D&reserved=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSUqKioqKioqKioqKioqKiUlKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqJSUqJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSU!!KGKeukY!2H_YexGensB_7IPl0QuIGz4JSmTQv0plAyNWCitZwpB23q_WOVd2XN0mPBc2CFoW_qwRyP-yE-EnLsF7knQ$> .

Heidi, do you have any added pointers?

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco <heb-naco-bounces at lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco-bounces at lists.osu.edu>> On Behalf Of Miller, Caroline via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 11:54 AM
To: Rachel Simon <rsimon at princeton.edu<mailto:rsimon at princeton.edu>>; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel <heb-naco at lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Arab name

I’ll take a stab at this. Per LC-PCC PS for 9.2.2.5.3, alternative, point 1 you need to use the Romanized form of name that appears on the piece, with all the appropriate 400’s. Caroline ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍

I’ll take a stab at this.  Per LC-PCC PS for 9.2.2.5.3, alternative, point 1 you need to use the Romanized form of name that appears on the piece, with all the appropriate 400’s.

Caroline

Caroline R. Miller

Team Leader, Discovery Team

UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services

2400 Life Sciences Building

621 Charles E Young Drive South

Box 957230

Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230

My pronouns are she/her/hers

From: Heb-naco <heb-naco-bounces+crmiller=library.ucla.edu at lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco-bounces+crmiller=library.ucla.edu at lists.osu.edu>> On Behalf Of Rachel Simon via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 7:20 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel <heb-naco at lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco at lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Arab name

What should be the authorized form of the name of an Arab writing in Hebrew, when the cover also has the name in Arabic? This related to the book by עלי ח'ליפה . Should the Hebrew form be Romanized as Ḥ'alifah, ʻAli ? ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍

What should be the authorized form of the name of an Arab writing in Hebrew, when the cover also has the name in Arabic? This related to the book by  עלי ח'ליפה . Should the Hebrew form be Romanized as Ḥ'alifah, ʻAli  ?

The Arabic would be Khalīfah, ʻAlī Ṣāliḥ

There is also a Romanized form of the name: Ali Khalefa.

Thanks,

Rachel

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