[Vwoolf] Flipping the script
Ellen Moody
ellen.moody at gmail.com
Tue May 3 15:10:35 EDT 2022
I've been teaching a course I called Anglo-Indian Novels for 10 weeks this
spring: you might say were I to use the nomenclature of my years teaching
undergraduates, I've had two sections of this. One at the Oscher Institute
of Lifelong Learning group of older adults attached to American University;
and one at the OLLI attached to George Mason University. The set texts
have been Forster's Passage to India, Scott's Jewel in the Crown (Raj
Quartet 1), and Jhumpa Lahirir's Namesake. I really have agonized over my
course title -- in my classes I've had people who detail the earlier
history of this term -- Indian people who emigrated to the US in the
1960s.. Both sections (so to speak) have gone so well that I'd like to
repeat it with different books (Farrell's Siege of Krisnapur, Rushdie's
Midnight Children and Lahiri's The Lowland). So should I change my course
title? The problem is I have found over and over again that the term
Anglo-Indian is used for novels written in English (the writer need not be
British) about India in literary studies. I've come across alternatives:
Indo-Anglian novels (even without the "c" this one makes me think of the
CofE church); British Novels about/of India, but my choice includes an
Irish writer and an American (sort of) one. I've come across others. I
realize the term has some bad baggage of racism but have almost decided
it's the most efficient broad general one.
Ellen Moody
On Tue, May 3, 2022 at 2:54 PM Marielle O'Neill (1806529) PHD via Vwoolf <
vwoolf at lists.osu.edu> wrote:
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> Hi Gretchen,
>
> Thanks for your points.
>
> However, I disagree with your comment, ' the term "Anglo-Indian" was used
> only for white English people living in India'- this is not the case in my
> family's experience around the time Woolf was writing 'Mrs Dalloway'. My
> grandmother born in the 1920s, her siblings and her father were not white
> (her mother was white Portuguese) but had Indian colouring and
> self-identified and were considered Anglo-Indian- so I think it is more
> nuanced and complex; and of course, race isn't always easy to categorise.
> My father was white and referred to himself as Anglo-Indian (Anglo-Indian
> mother and Anglo-Irish father). As you said, the context is important and
> the term Anglo-Indian in the sense that Woolf knew it and that way of life
> did die out when India gained its independence. As we know, Woolf herself
> was part Anglo-Indian with Julia Stephen having Bengali heritage.
>
> Warm wishes,
> Marielle
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vwoolf <vwoolf-bounces+m.oneill=leedstrinity.ac.uk at lists.osu.edu>
> On Behalf Of Gretchen Gerzina via Vwoolf
> Sent: 03 May 2022 15:00
> To: vwoolf at lists.osu.edu
> Subject: Re: [Vwoolf] Flipping the script
>
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> Hello everyone,
>
> The important thing to remember in all of this is that at the time Woolf
> was writing, the term "Anglo-Indian" was used only for white English people
> living in India. It wasn't until much later that the term changed to refer
> to mixed-race English/Indian people, which is the way it is used today--and
> the way it is generally defined now in dictionaries. But it was not used
> that way when Mrs. Dalloway was written, as readers at that time would have
> understood.
>
> Similarly, the word "Creole" used to refer to all people, including white
> people, who were born and raised in the Caribbean. In the 18th century, it
> was used mainly for the plantocracy, who sent their (white) Caribbean
> offspring to live or be educated in Britain.
>
> As a mixed-race person who is keenly aware of these linguistic nuances,
> and teaches and writes about race in the UK, I think it's important to
> understand how these words were used and understood at the time of the
> writing in which they appear, and how that differs from today's usage.
>
> --Gretchen Gerzina
>
>
>
> On 5/2/22, 8:59 PM, "vwoolf-bounces at lists.osu.edu on behalf of
> vwoolf-request at lists.osu.edu" <vwoolf-bounces at lists.osu.edu on behalf of
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> Today's Topics:
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> 1. Re: Flipping the script on Virginia Woolf (Stuart N. Clarke)
> 2. Inclusivity (Stuart N. Clarke)
> 3. Re: Flipping the script on Virginia Woolf (Alice E. Staveley)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 2 May 2022 10:49:35 +0100
> From: "Stuart N. Clarke" <stuart.n.clarke at btinternet.com>
> To: <vwoolf at lists.osu.edu>
> Subject: Re: [Vwoolf] Flipping the script on Virginia Woolf
> Message-ID: <227D222ACACE416EBBD5E610BC2C0E47 at StuartHP>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8";
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> Dear oh dear oh dear. So Daisy is a Eurasian, is she? I expect the
> author
> was tempted by the ref. to Daisy's being "very dark" - and ran with
> it.
> Shall we speculate on how many Eurasians were publicly married to
> majors in
> the Indian Army at that time? Daisy doesn't seem to be ostracised,
> since
> there are refs. to Majors Orde and Simmons (or is he her husband? the
> author
> thinks so). Peter Walsh has confided in Mrs Burgess in India, who has
> pointed out the disadvantages of his marrying Daisy, but she has made
> no
> ref. to the enormous additional problems he would face in marrying a
> divorced mixed-race woman.
>
> Instead of "There?s something wonderfully subversive about taking a
> well-known Western text and flipping it inside out to reveal societal
> truths", it's sounds more like piggy-backing on Woolf to sell copies
> of this
> (fantasy) novel.
>
> Stuart
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kristin Czarnecki via Vwoolf
> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2022 10:04 PM
> To: Virginia Woolf
> Subject: [Vwoolf] Flipping the script on Virginia Woolf
>
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> A new book explores the character of Daisy from MD.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Kristin
>
>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 2 May 2022 11:26:31 +0100
> From: "Stuart N. Clarke" <stuart.n.clarke at btinternet.com>
> To: <vwoolf at lists.osu.edu>
> Subject: [Vwoolf] Inclusivity
> Message-ID: <E7550605DF6848649FD24F9E22A2B096 at StuartHP>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Wasn?t some reviewer/commentator quoted on this list not long ago,
> saying that great writers were never inclusive, or some such rubbish?
>
> What we do have to remember that inclusivity as we understand it
> nowadays is a very recent way of looking at the world (pace Mrs Swithin and
> Prof Godbole). Previously, distinguishing people one from the other ?
> exclusivity ? was how one looked at life.
>
> ?*doct(o)ress.* It is a serious inconvenience that neither form
> (-tress would be the better) has been brought into any but facetious use as
> a prefixed title? (H. W. Fowler, ?A Dictionary of Modern English Usage
> (Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1926), p. 120a
>
> ?What has given Jenufa this strange idea, that her dress is so plain
> and sombre on her wedding day??
> ?What, Jenufa? All the finest gentry dress plainly and simply when
> they go to the altar!?
> ?Gentle folk have their own fashions and customs, but we are only
> simple people! I?d never dream of being wed without my bridal crown and
> ribbons never! Never!?
> (Libretto to Janacek?s opera)
>
> Of course, in 3G Woolf deplores the uniforms and badges of distinction
> that set men off from one another. Of course, she writes: ?it seems to me
> the wrong way to live, drawing chalk marks round ones feet, and saying ...
> you can?t come in? (L no. 3111). But she?s a long way from inclusivity in
> the modern sense.
>
> I?m was reminded about isolated people were from one another, when I
> was reading recently two collections I?ve had for 45 years, ?My Cambridge?
> and ?My Oxford? (I hadn?t realised how miserable Nigel Nicolson was at
> Balliol).
>
> ?it was not till my first term at Cambridge that I spoke to my first
> Jew and met my first black man (from Blackpool and Jamaica respectively)?
> (John Vaizey (1929-84), went up to Queens? in 1948).
>
> There could be an advantage if you were gay: ?I think I can safely say
> that, until I went to Oxford, I had never known anyone of working-class
> background. There had, of course, been my London promiscuous sexual
> encounters. Many of these had been with cockney working-class young men.
> But this life which had begun before I was sixteen was a world as separate
> from my daily life as were my dreams ... Apart from that, the only
> working-class people I had known were servants ? and, given my family?s
> near penury, these were not many. I had never known anyone well who came
> from north of the Home Counties; and, apart from one visit with my father
> to Scotland ... I had never penetrated into England north of Hampstead?
> (Angus Wilson (1913-91, went up to Merton in 1935).
>
> Stuart
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 3 May 2022 00:59:10 +0000
> From: "Alice E. Staveley" <staveley at stanford.edu>
> To: "Stuart N. Clarke" <stuart.n.clarke at btinternet.com>
> Cc: "vwoolf at lists.osu.edu" <vwoolf at lists.osu.edu>
> Subject: Re: [Vwoolf] Flipping the script on Virginia Woolf
> Message-ID: <14324AE1-CED9-4D46-B055-526F0F789A1C at stanford.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Dear Stuart,
>
> While I have deliberated responding en groupe to this message, I think
> it?s important to note that every year I teach Mrs Dalloway someone asks me
> whether Daisy could be mixed race (Eurasian an outdated term to their
> ears). This is not naive reading or willful ignorance, but because there
> is sufficient textual ambiguity (pace your bullet points) around Daisy?s
> identity and role in the novel ? a novel all about the deep human costs of
> categorical boxes that deleteriously hem in people?s lives ? that I take
> their readings as teachable moments.
>
> Textual ambiguity is a wonderful place to start unpacking all those
> thorny questions about representation, including racial, sexual, gendered,
> and class segregations, alongside their historical roots. Why, one might
> ask, should we assume Daisy is white? Statistically, as you note, that?s
> more probable, but then again those statistics themselves have a history
> students need to learn in the context of colonialist fears about Englishmen
> going to India without wives to keep them ?honest?.
> This can open up a rich seam of discussion about other legal and
> cultural prohibitions and prescriptions against miscegenation in the era,
> along with the general interrogation of the ?marriage plot' in Mrs
> Dalloway.
>
> Given my students? responses, it is not to me surprising that a
> contemporary Australian writer of Goan-Anglo Indian heritage might herself
> be inspired to find in creative adaptation of Woolf?s famous novel a form
> of reinterpretation that is more than mercenary. I have not read her book,
> but I believe, as I think the spirit of your later messages imply, it could
> help us all take a hard look at just how limiting are fixed categorical
> boxes, however much the 'nightmare of history? reminds us of their
> continuing presence.
>
> Best wishes
> Alice
>
> Alice Staveley, D.Phil.
> Senior Lecturer
> Department of English
> Stanford University
> Director | Honors English
> Director | Digital Humanities Minor
> Co-Founder
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>
>
> On May 2, 2022, at 2:49 AM, Stuart N. Clarke via Vwoolf <
> vwoolf at lists.osu.edu<mailto:vwoolf at lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
>
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> Dear oh dear oh dear. So Daisy is a Eurasian, is she? I expect the
> author was tempted by the ref. to Daisy's being "very dark" - and ran with
> it. Shall we speculate on how many Eurasians were publicly married to
> majors in the Indian Army at that time? Daisy doesn't seem to be
> ostracised, since there are refs. to Majors Orde and Simmons (or is he her
> husband? the author thinks so). Peter Walsh has confided in Mrs Burgess in
> India, who has pointed out the disadvantages of his marrying Daisy, but she
> has made no ref. to the enormous additional problems he would face in
> marrying a divorced mixed-race woman.
>
> Instead of "There?s something wonderfully subversive about taking a
> well-known Western text and flipping it inside out to reveal societal
> truths", it's sounds more like piggy-backing on Woolf to sell copies of
> this (fantasy) novel.
>
> Stuart
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Kristin Czarnecki via Vwoolf
> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2022 10:04 PM
> To: Virginia Woolf
> Subject: [Vwoolf] Flipping the script on Virginia Woolf
>
> !-------------------------------------------------------------------|
> This Message Is From an External Sender
> This message came from outside your organization.
> |-------------------------------------------------------------------!
>
> A new book explores the character of Daisy from MD.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Kristin
>
>
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