[Vwoolf] Apocryphal lines & Woolf's suicide

Sat Jun 16 22:53:27 EDT 2012

Without trying to rewrite history or pontificate too much about what one should or should not have done in the circumstances of an impending  German invasion, one might justifiably wonder why so many of the Bloomsbury group - Vita and Adrian as Vara mentioned as well as others - were so quick to decide to kill themselves as the only response.  People of intelligence, education, means, connections not to mention a printing press were just what was needed for resistance, propaganda etc.    Julian Bell is the only one who really put himself o the lie.

Consider  - what would have happeed  if all the intelligentsia of every occupied county voluntarily killed themselves?

Steve Posin 
415-921-3649 h
415-596-8125 c

>________________________________
> From: "Neverow, Vara S." <neverowv1 at southernct.edu>
>To: jeannette smyth <jeannette_smyth at earthlink.net>; Woolf list <vwoolf at lists.service.ohio-state.edu> 
>Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2012 6:06 PM
>Subject: Re: [Vwoolf] Apocryphal lines & Woolf's suicide
>  
>
>Hi Jeannette,
>
>
>Yes—both Leonard and Virginia justly feared the potential implications of such a situation and had stockpiled both petrol and morphine so that they could commit suicide if the Nazis were to invade Sussex by planning to run the engine of their automobile in their garage (carbon monoxide, a side product of combustion, has no smell), while having already taken lethal doses of morphine as a precaution to ensure their deaths. On page 150 of the monograph, Orr points out that multiple Woolf family members and friends (including Adrian Stephen and Vita Sackville-West) had already stashed away medications that would guarantee a relatively quick and painless demise if Britain were to fall. 
>
>
>Best,
>
>
>Vara
>
>From:  jeannette smyth <jeannette_smyth at earthlink.net>
>Reply-To:  jeannette smyth <jeannette_smyth at earthlink.net>
>To:  VWOOLF listserv <vwoolf at lists.service.ohio-state.edu>
>Subject:  Re: [Vwoolf] Apocryphal lines & Woolf's suicide
>
>
>
>Thank you for this excellent Orr information; I know Sir Leslie's financial anxiety was formative in Woolf's life, as well as Virginia's and Leonard's natural asceticism and frugality. 
> 
>Another factor in her suicide, as I understand it, was the imminence of a Nazi invasion. I think this is mentioned, rather brutally, by Vanessa, in one of her letters to Virginia -- the prospect of being an "invalid" or raving lunatic at such a time, with both Leonard and herself on Hitler's to-kill list. 
> 
>Finally, as I understand it, Adrian Stephen, a physician, had provided them all with a suicide pill in the event of a successful Nazi invasion. 
> 
>These factors, along with the Bloomsberries' longstanding atheism and Leonard's carefully cultivated stoicism (via Montaigne/Seneca), would have made Virginia Woolf's suicide the altruistic, logical, long-contemplated, communitarian and sane decision -- the absolute opposite of a romantic madwoman's hurling herself into the abyss -- that it seems to have been.
> 
>Thanks.
>Jeannette Smyth
>
>-----Original Message----- 
>>From: "Neverow, Vara S." 
>>Sent: Jun 14, 2012 8:36 AM 
>>To: "helt0010 at umn.edu" , Woolf list 
>>Cc: Wayne Chapman 
>>Subject: Re: [Vwoolf] Apocryphal lines & Woolf's suicide 
>>
>>
>>With regard to Woolf's suicide, I would recommend that Woolfians also consult the monograph Virginia Woolf's Illnesses by Douglass W. Orr <http://www.clemson.edu/cedp/cudp/pubs/orr/main.htm>. Orr argues very convincingly that Woolf's suicide was linked to financial anxieties. If she were to have needed nursing care, the costs would have been devastating. Chapter 14 of the volume is exceptionally informative on this topic and can be read in a searchable PDF format (many thanks to Wayne Chapman, for not only publishing the manuscript but also making it so readily accessible!).
>>
>>
>>Vara Neverow
>>
>>From: Brenda Helt <helt0010 at umn.edu>
>>Reply-To: "helt0010 at umn.edu" <helt0010 at umn.edu>
>>To: VWOOLF listserv <vwoolf at lists.service.ohio-state.edu>
>>Subject: [Vwoolf] Apocryphal lines & Woolf's suicide
>>
>>
>>
>>Um, then don’t?  I’m disturbed by tendencies among scholars and others to attempt to recuperate Woolf’s suicide in ways that might make it seem a model for those who see her as an icon.  She left a suicide note—in fact, she left two.  Leonard is also on record as to the reasons for the suicide.  Surely it’s sufficient to stick to the primary source evidence of what Woolf actually said before taking her life, together with the long history of her fight with mental illness as recorded in her diaries and letters as well as in Leonard’s autobiography, Vanessa’s letters, etc.  I think we tread on dangerous ground when we give voice in the classroom or on the stage or in print to a redemptive view of Woolf’s suicide that the evidence does not support.  She feared she was again going mad and would not recover this time.  She calls what she suffers from a “disease,” which it is.  This is what she said.  Why not tell students about
 that fear and have a discussion about depression, bipolar disorder, and mental illness more generally?  About the likely outcomes of not getting such diseases treated properly—“proper” treatment was not available for Woolf at this time.  Of course, do your research first.  And Hermione Lee’s biography of Woolf is quite solidly grounded in the facts on the issue of her suicide.  I’d read her pages dedicated to the suicide before talking about it with students.
>> 
>>Hope that’s helpful.
>> 
>> 
>>Brenda Helt
>> 
>>From:vwoolf-bounces+helt0010=umn.edu at lists.service.ohio-state.edu [mailto:vwoolf-bounces+helt0010=umn.edu at lists.service.ohio-state.edu] On Behalf Of Melody Wilson
>>Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2012 6:14 AM
>>To: atleswoolf at aol.com
>>Cc: Vwoolf at lists.service.ohio-state.edu
>>Subject: Re: [Vwoolf] Apocryphal lines
>> 
>>Interesting--I'm very troubled about putting words in her mouth as well.
>>
>>Be Wise
>> 
>>
>>On Jun 14, 2012, at 6:12 AM, atleswoolf at aol.com wrote:
>>As far as I know, these lines are the screenwriter David Hare's and not Michael Cunningham's.  They don't appear in the novel -- only in the film.  I read somewhere a while back that Hare said he was nervous about putting such words into Woolf's mouth, or something to that effect.
>>> 
>>>Best, 
>>>Drew Shannon
>>>College of Mount St. Joseph
>>>
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Melody Wilson <melodywilson at tds.net>
>>>To: Vwoolf at lists.osu.edu <Vwoolf at lists.service.ohio-state.edu>
>>>Sent: Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:51 am
>>>Subject: [Vwoolf] Apocryphal lines
>>>Dear Woolfians:
>>>I am writing a eulogy, and after showing The Hours in my class (we had read 
>>>Dalloway), I was struck by the final lines I paraphrase as to look life in the 
>>>face and to love it...then to put it away (I'm stuck in this screen and can't 
>>>verify).  I have done a preliminary search and think these are cunningham's 
>>>lines (he attributes them to one of the suicide notes).  Can anyone verify that 
>>>these lines are not Woolf's?  I will probably open w them anyway as the are 
>>>appropriate but I would like to know.  Thanks for your help.
>>> 
>>>Be Wise
>>> 
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>>>Vwoolf mailing list
>>>Vwoolf at lists.service.ohio-state.edu
>>>https://lists.service.ohio-state.edu/mailman/listinfo/vwoolf 
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