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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">The "colonial" is presumably a man, and
presumably white. The (old) OED is not very helpful here, and has
more on the word's American reference pre-independence.<br>
<br>
I suspect that a South African is unlikely as an Afrikaaner would
probably not be in a London pub and a South African with a British
background would probably not want to have a go at the British
monarchy. Ditto white settlers from the rest of Africa. A Canadian
is possible, but although I suggested it, a man from Quebec is
much more likely to want to be in Paris than in London. How likely
it is that a Canadian not from Quebec would be likely to insult
the House of Windsor at this time I'm not sure. An Anglo-Indian
(if that is the term) would, if my reading of Forster has any
weight, be also be pretty unlikely to be insulting the House of
Windsor. There are other possibilities, but this does leave
Australia and New Zealand as the main options. I have a fuzzy
sense that republicanism was more of a live issue in Australia
than New Zealand at this time, but am prepared to be corrected.
And Australians, however unfairly, are still associated with (a)
pubs and (b) speaking their minds. (As Russell Crowe put it once
it an interview I saw on TV - "I like the occasional drink".)<br>
<br>
Does Woolf use "Colonial" in this sense elsewhere? I find myself
wondering whether the word really was used at this time as a
patronising generaliser for all (white) inhabitants of any British
colony, or whether it rather served as a euphemism for those who
came from a particular colony or group of colonies. This is where
corpus analysis might be illuminating.<br>
<br>
Jeremy<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Den 17.09.2012 18:57, skrev Jean Mallinson:<br>
</div>
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I have been following this discussion marginally and can't help
interjecting that "refeened" does not at all describe the
Quebecois, who regularly insult the Royal Family on their home
ground. As a Canadian, I still cringe at the collective noun "a
Colonial" , as though we were all the same, distinguished only by
the fact that we are not "British". The Colonial might be
"Canadian". A Canadian I know got into a fight in a pub in the UK
decades later for insulting Lord Mountbatten -- in this instance
because of the Dieppe Raid.<br>
Jean Mallinson
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 9/17/2012 12:17 AM, Stuart N.
Clarke wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:7A636A93A0DA486381BE833B28310E53@StuartHP"
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<div>It seems to me significant that VW made the change from
“a Colonial insulted the Royal family” in “The Prime
Minister” (“Complete Shorter Fiction”, 1989, App. B) to “a
Colonial insulted the House of Windsor” in “Mrs.
Dalloway”.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Stuart</div>
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<div> </div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<div style="font-color: black"><b>From:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="stuart.n.clarke@btinternet.com"
href="mailto:stuart.n.clarke@btinternet.com">Stuart
N. Clarke</a> </div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, September 16, 2012 1:29 PM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu"
href="mailto:vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu">vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a>
</div>
<div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vwoolf] Darlings, am I a
snob?</div>
</div>
</div>
<div> </div>
</div>
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FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: small;
FONT-WEIGHT: normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none">
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div>I too tend to think Australian. Perhaps the
Quebecois are more refeened, as Mrs Manresa would
say (her grandfather may have been “exported” to
Tasmania). Rather than colonial republicanism, I
was thinking more along the lines of: “They’re a
load of bloody Krauts, the whole lot of ‘em”.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Stuart</div>
<div style="FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline;
FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE:
small; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none">
<div style="FONT: 10pt tahoma">
<div> </div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<div style="font-color: black"><b>From:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="jeremy.hawthorn@ntnu.no"
href="mailto:jeremy.hawthorn@ntnu.no">Jeremy
Hawthorn</a> </div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, September 16, 2012
12:55 PM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="stuart.n.clarke@btinternet.com"
href="mailto:stuart.n.clarke@btinternet.com">Stuart
N. Clarke</a> ; <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu"
href="mailto:vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu">vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a>
</div>
<div><b>Subject:</b> RE: [Vwoolf] Darlings, am I
a snob?</div>
</div>
</div>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div style="FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline;
FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE:
small; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none">
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: tahoma; DIRECTION: ltr;
COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Hmm, not sure
about that, Stuart. "In a public-house in a back
street a Colonial insulted the House of Windsor,
which led to words, broken beer glasses, and a
general shindy ...". I find it hard to believe
that a comment along the lines of "They should
never have changed the name to Windsor, bloody
silly name if you ask me" would evoke such a
response. More likely that it is Virginia who is
being careful, not wanting to state directly that
anyone would insult the monarch. In a posting a
few years back I admitted that I always assumed
that the Colonial was an Australian, but he
(presumably it is he) could also have come from
Quebec . . .<br>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman; COLOR:
#000000; FONT-SIZE: 16px">
<hr tabindex="-1">
<div style="DIRECTION: ltr" id="divRpF56107"><font
color="#000000" face="Tahoma" size="2"><b>From:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:vwoolf-bounces@lists.service.ohio-state.edu">vwoolf-bounces@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a>
[<a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:vwoolf-bounces@lists.service.ohio-state.edu">vwoolf-bounces@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a>]
on behalf of Stuart N. Clarke [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:stuart.n.clarke@btinternet.com">stuart.n.clarke@btinternet.com</a>]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 16 September 2012 10:39<br>
<b>To:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu">vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Vwoolf] Darlings, am I a
snob?<br>
</font><br>
</div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR:
#000000; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div>I think it’s reasonable to assume
that this is another wartime ref. The
colonial doesn’t insult the monarchy but
the “House of Windsor” – a madey-uppy
name created in 1917 to try to reassure
the public that the Guelphs (as VW
tended to call them) were really
British.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>For various reasons, this year has
slipped out of my grasp. And I was *so*
looking forward to getting my hands on
the Duke of Cambridge.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>(No, not the new one.)</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Stuart</div>
<div style="FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY:
inline; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR:
#000000; FONT-SIZE: small; FONT-WEIGHT:
normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none">
<div style="FONT: 10pt tahoma">
<div> </div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<div><b>From:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="jeremy.hawthorn@ntnu.no"
href="mailto:jeremy.hawthorn@ntnu.no" target="_blank">Jeremy Hawthorn</a>
</div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Saturday,
September 15, 2012 9:14 PM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu"
href="mailto:vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu" target="_blank">vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a>
</div>
<div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vwoolf]
Darlings, am I a snob?</div>
</div>
</div>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div style="FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY:
inline; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR:
#000000; FONT-SIZE: small; FONT-WEIGHT:
normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none">
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: tahoma;
DIRECTION: ltr; COLOR: #000000;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Also in Mrs Dalloway,
doesn't a "colonial" insult the House
of Windsor?<br>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new
roman; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE:
16px">
<hr tabindex="-1">
<div style="DIRECTION: ltr"
id="divRpF854341"><font
color="#000000" face="Tahoma"
size="2"><b>From:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:vwoolf-bounces@lists.service.ohio-state.edu">vwoolf-bounces@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a>
[<a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:vwoolf-bounces@lists.service.ohio-state.edu">vwoolf-bounces@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a>]
on behalf of Andrea [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:andrea.adolph@gmail.com">andrea.adolph@gmail.com</a>]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 15 September 2012
21:17<br>
<b>To:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu">vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vwoolf]
Darlings, am I a snob?<br>
</font><br>
</div>
<div>And now I see on Facebook that
Persephone Books has bought and
made cushions from a fabric
purchased at Charleston--it's
called "Queen Mary" and is a
Duncan Grant print.<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sat,
Sep 15, 2012 at 11:55 AM, Stuart
N. Clarke <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stuart.n.clarke@btinternet.com"
target="_blank">stuart.n.clarke@btinternet.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT:
#ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px
0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT:
1ex" class="gmail_quote">Swoon
. . .<br>
<br>
As I say, there's much more to
be done. Princess Mary pops
up in "Mrs. Dalloway" as a
symbol of the post-war world,
because she is "married to an
Englishman".<br>
<br>
Stuart<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----
From: Adolphe Haberer<br>
Sent: Saturday, September 15,
2012 4:42 PM<br>
To: Stuart N. Clarke ; <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu"
target="_blank">vwoolf@lists.service.ohio-state.edu</a><br>
Subject: Re: [Vwoolf]
Darlings, am I a snob?
<div class="HOEnZb">
<div class="h5"><br>
<br>
If Stuart wants to include
VW's fiction in his<br>
research, there is a
discreet and rather
elegant<br>
reference to the Royal
Family in chapter V of<br>
Jacob's Room:<br>
<br>
"The autumn season was in
full swing. Tristan was
twitching his rug up<br>
under his armpits twice a
week; Isolde waved her
scarf in miraculous<br>
sympathy with the
conductor's baton. In all
parts of the house were to<br>
be found pink faces and
glittering breasts. When a
Royal hand attached<br>
to an invisible body
slipped out and withdrew
the red and white bouquet<br>
reposing on the scarlet
ledge, the Queen of
England seemed a name
worth<br>
dying for."<br>
<br>
Ado<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote
style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc
1px solid; MARGIN: 0px
0px 0px 0.8ex;
PADDING-LEFT: 1ex"
class="gmail_quote">We
really must do more
research on VW and the
Royal Family.<br>
<br>
In "Street Haunting",
when the narrator
imagines being in
Mayfair, she concludes
her reverie with
"watching the moonlit
cat creep along Princess
Mary's garden wall" (The
Essays, Vol. IV, p.
486).<br>
<br>
Princess Mary and her
husband Lord Lascelles
did indeed live in
Mayfair, in Chesterfield
House -- "where the
famous letters were
penned" (Ward, Lock
Guide to London, 1934,
p. 129. It was on the
corner of South Audley
Street and Curzon
Street, and was
demolished in 1937.<br>
<br>
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary,_Princess_Royal_and_Countess_of_Harewood"
target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary,_Princess_Royal_and_Countess_of_Harewood</a>><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary,_Princess_Royal_and_Countess_of_Harewood"
target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary,_Princess_Royal_and_Countess_of_Harewood</a><br>
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chesterfield_House,_Westminster"
target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chesterfield_House,_Westminster</a>><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chesterfield_House,_Westminster"
target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chesterfield_House,_Westminster</a><br>
<br>
Another footnote is
required.<br>
<br>
Stuart<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Adolphe Haberer<br>
Professeur émérite,
Université Lumière-Lyon 2,<br>
1, route de Saint-Antoine<br>
F-69380 Chazay d'Azergues<br>
tel & fax <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%2B33%20%280%294%2078%2043%2065%2024"
target="_blank"
value="+33478436524">+33
(0)4 78 43 65 24</a><br>
E-mail : <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Adolphe.Haberer@univ-lyon2.fr"
target="_blank">Adolphe.Haberer@univ-lyon2.fr</a>>,
<<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:ado@haberer.fr"
target="_blank">ado@haberer.fr</a>><br>
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<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Jeremy Hawthorn
Emeritus professor
Department of Modern Foreign Languages
NTNU
7491 Trondheim
Norway
(00 47) 73596787 (NTNU)
(00 47) 72887602 (home
(00 47) 90181427 (cellphone)</pre>
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