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Thank you, yes, those are good points to remember. <br>
<br>
Jasmin<br>
<hr style="display:inline-block;width:98%" tabindex="-1">
<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Heb-naco <heb-naco-bounces@lists.osu.edu> on behalf of Kohn, Roger <rkoh@loc.gov><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 20, 2016 4:17:19 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Hebrew Name Authority Funnel<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Heb-NACO] To Jasmin Sh. re.: More than one 264 (was: 264 bracketed dates: = or that is?</font>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">---<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">Jasmin,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">You asked if you missed anything, here what I would say:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">We should remember that there is more than one 264 in the MARC format<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">So far the discussion has been concentrated on the 264 – 1<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">Copyright dates can be recorded in 264 – 4<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">For clarity sake, it might be helpful to address all the aspects of transcribing the date found on the
book in the various 264 offered by the MARC format …<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">There is also to keep in mind the concept of RDA “Core”, “LC Core” and “cataloger’s judgment”,
</span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#03070D;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#03070D;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">in other words:
</span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">what is mandated</span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#03070D;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#03070D;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">,
</span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">what is prefe</span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#03070D;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#03070D;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">r</span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">red</span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#03070D;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#03070D;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">
and/or what can be ignored according to RDA </span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"> …<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">So, I am not sure that your “Putting 1. and 2. together” covers all possibilities.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">All the best,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">- r.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#1E1C11;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:black;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
<br>
Roger Kohn<br>
Cataloger, Israel & Judaica Section<br>
Library of Congress<br>
LS/ABA/ASME/IJ (4222) <br>
LM 537<br>
101 Independence Avenue, SE<br>
Washington, D.C. 20540-4222<br>
(202) 707-3997<br>
<br>
"Opinions expressed are those of the author, and are not official statements by the Library of Congress."<br>
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -</span><span style="font-family:"Garamond","serif";mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Heb-naco [<a href="mailto:heb-naco-bounces+rkoh=loc.gov@lists.osu.edu">mailto:heb-naco-bounces+rkoh=loc.gov@lists.osu.edu</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Neil Manel Frau-Cortes<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 20, 2016 3:26 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Hebrew Name Authority Funnel<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Heb-NACO] 264 bracketed dates: = or that is?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I thought that in your B case we were supposed to write [Heb, that is, Greg]<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Neil<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 3:12 PM, Shinohara, Jasmin <<a href="mailto:jshino@pobox.upenn.edu" target="_blank">jshino@pobox.upenn.edu</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">1. You write below "present on the t.p. verso" and "present on the publication"; remember that both are equivalent in terms of RDA. The entire body of work is considered the "preferred source of information" (formerly, "chief source of
information", or "csi"). Where equivalent data appears in both vernacular and Roman forms, the "=" is used to show the two "parallel" forms.<br>
<br>
2. Unless a work _specifically_ indicates a publication dates, the dates in the 264 are bracketed. Hence, anywhere you have either a _copyright_ or a _printing_ date, it will be in brackets.<br>
<br>
Putting 1. and 2. together:<br>
<br>
A. If the resource gives a date anywhere in the publication in _both_ the Hebrew and the Gregorian forms, the 264 would give both, using the = to indicate both are present.<br>
B. If the date is something other than a publication date and appears in _both_ the Hebrew and the Gregorian forms, it will appear as [Heb. = Greg.].<br>
C. If a publication date is ONLY given in the Heb., the Heb. form will appear without brackets and "that is" will be added to give the inferred Greg. date inside brackets.<br>
D. If a publication date is ONLY given in the Heb., BUT there is another form of the date in the Greg. OR a more detailed Heb. date appears elsewhere in the source, the Heb. form will appear without brackets and the inferred Greg. date will be given in brackets,
without either "=" or "that is" because the data is neither equivalent nor inferred.<br>
<br>
Capiche? Others, did I miss anything?<br>
<span style="color:#888888"><br>
<span class="hoenzb">Jasmin</span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Heb-naco [mailto:<a href="mailto:heb-naco-bounces@lists.osu.edu">heb-naco-bounces@lists.osu.edu</a>] On Behalf Of Robert M. TALBOTT<br>
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2016 2:04 PM<br>
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel<br>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] 264 bracketed dates: = or that is?<br>
<br>
Folks:<br>
<br>
I've been seeing an awful lot of bracketed dates utilizing the equals<br>
(=) sign, to wit:<br>
<br>
where only a copyright of 774 and a copyright of 2014 are present on the t.p. verso<br>
<br>
$c [774 = 2014]<br>
<br>
As I read the HCM (2.8.6, pp. 47-48), it appears that the equals sign is only used in instances where there are two firm dates that are unbracketed. Again, as I understand it, inside brackets, the phrase "that is" is used.<br>
<br>
where only a copyright of 774 and a copyright of 2014 are present on the publication<br>
<br>
$c [774, that is, 2014]<br>
<br>
Am I wrong? Have things changed?<br>
<br>
Thanks<br>
<br>
Bob<br>
--<br>
Bob Talbott<br>
<br>
Principal cataloger/Hebraica cataloger<br>
<br>
UC Berkeley<br>
<br>
250 Moffitt<br>
<br>
Berkeley, CA 94720<br>
<br>
I'm just mad about Saffron<br>
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<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-- <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="color:black">Neil M. Frau-Cortes, Ph.D.</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style="color:black">Judaica, Hebraica and Metadata Cataloger</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style="color:black">McKeldin Library</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style="color:black">University of Maryland<br>
College Park, MD 20742<br>
Phone (301) 405-9337</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style="color:black"><a href="http://nfrau@umd.edu" target="_blank">nfrau@umd.edu</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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