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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Ahava, thank you for the input! Heidi, the trick is that the data presented formally on the t.p. verso is usually
<i>not</i> a publication date but a printing or copyright date. In those cases, which is better in the 264 1, a bracketed publication date deduced from the data on the t.p. verso? Or the date from the back cover that, according to Ahava and the Israeli national
cataloging committee, is considered a publication statement?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">For others looking for the instructions regarding Hebrew dates in the vernacular, it is on p. 22 of the PCC Guidelines, Appendix A.5.4. (It’s not in section
1.3 on Descriptive fields, p.4-5, where I first looked.) In answer to my own question, yes, PCC now follows LC and we are to supply non-Latin script for Hebrew dates in the vernacular 264 (and Arabic dates in rom. 264). I presume
<i>HCR</i> will be updated accordingly.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Thanks, Jasmin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+jshino=pobox.upenn.edu@lists.osu.edu]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Heidi G Lerner<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, June 29, 2016 11:03 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Hebrew Name Authority Funnel<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Heb-NACO] hebrew dates in 264 redux<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Thank you Ahavah, this is very helpful. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Jasmin, RDA 2.8.6.2 does not specify an order of preference for source of information of date of publication within a resource if it does not appear in the same source
as the title proper.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">It is ambiguous which should be considered more authoritative; a date of publication without the month which is presented formally on a title page verso or a date with
a month on the back cover. Probably neither is wrong. Perhaps the AJL RAS cataloging committee might want to come up with a best practice; however for those of us who create bib records for PCC will follow more common guidelines, even if they don't really
exist.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Guidelines for recording Hebrew dates in vernacular fields is found in the recently updated document.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Best, Heidi<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-size:16.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">PCC Guidelines for Creating Bibliographic
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-size:16.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Records in Multiple Character Sets <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Heidi G. Lerner<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Metadata Dept.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Stanford University Libraries<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Stanford, CA 94305-6004<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">ph: 650-725-9953<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">fax: 650-725-1120<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">e-mail:
<a href="mailto:lerner@stanford.edu">lerner@stanford.edu</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"> Heb-naco <<a href="mailto:heb-naco-bounces+lerner=stanford.edu@lists.osu.edu">heb-naco-bounces+lerner=stanford.edu@lists.osu.edu</a>>
on behalf of Ahava Cohen <<a href="mailto:soferim@013net.net">soferim@013net.net</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, June 29, 2016 5:08 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Hebrew Name Authority Funnel<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Heb-NACO] hebrew dates in 264 redux</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">The dates on the covers of books have legal standing in Israel. According to paragraph 5b of the Books and Authors Law publishers must put the date of
printing (publication) of the first edition of the book on the outside cover of print versions. The law was recently amended and it is unclear if publishers will continue providing this date past September 2016.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">For what it's worth, the Israeli national cataloging committee recently ruled that this date may be used as a publication statement in the absence of
an explicit publication statement, but that the cover is a less preferred source than are the title page and title page verso. This date does not, despite the wording of the law, serve as an edition statement in and of itself.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Ahava <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">---------<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Ahava Cohen<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Head, Hebrew Cataloguing Department<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">National Library of Israel<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">---- Original Message ----<br>
<b>From</b>: "Shinohara, Jasmin" <<a href="mailto:jshino@pobox.upenn.edu">jshino@pobox.upenn.edu</a>><br>
<b>To</b>: "Hebrew Name Authority Funnel" <<a href="mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu">heb-naco@lists.osu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Sent</b>: Wed, Jun 29, 2016, 1:19 AM<br>
<b>Subject</b>: [Heb-NACO] hebrew dates in 264 redux<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white">
<span style="color:black">Following our committee meeting, and to be sure I have it straight, please confirm that PCC now follows LC and we are to supply non-Latin script for Hebrew dates in the vernacular 264 (and Arabic dates in rom. 264).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white">
<span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white">
<span style="color:black">Also, I’m noticing many cases when the date appears on the back of the book, e.g.
</span><span lang="HE" dir="RTL" style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">éåìé 2015</span><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black"><span dir="LTR"></span>, the bib record disregards that information and only records what appears on the t.p.
verso (typically ©</span><span lang="HE" dir="RTL" style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">úùò"ä</span><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black"><span dir="LTR"></span>, ©2015, or ©</span><span lang="HE" dir="RTL" style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">éåìé
2015</span><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black"><span dir="LTR"></span>]), so bibs currently have 2641 [775 = 2015] or [775 = Yuli 2015] with a 2644 for the © dates. Shouldn’t it just be 2641 Yuli 2015 (and vern 2641
</span><span lang="HE" dir="RTL" style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">éåìé 2015</span><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black"><span dir="LTR"></span>) with fixed fields DtSt e/Date 1 2015/Date 2 07?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white">
<span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white">
<span style="color:black">Thanks, Jasmin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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